Electric Car News

[Sneakers]

Maybe it's me, but Musk seems to be a flake in the direction of the company.

I was leaning that way recently over the decision to lay off nearly the entire charging team. But then I saw an article that made a lot of sense. It has to do with the adoption of the NACS connector. Prior, Tesla was the only company that had rights to it. Once the rights were released and other car manufacturers got on board, the competing charge companies like Electrify America have all been switching to NACS. With all of these companies now providing charge points that are Tesla compatible, there is no longer an urgent need to expand the Tesla charge stations. Let the other companies pick up the load and save money on deployment of "unnecessary" redundant stations. In NYC, there were Tesla "abandoned" charge stations which have been bought out by competitors. Yes, Tesla charge stations were far superior, but once there is an outcry from people to fix/improve other stations, they will be forced to improve. Nothing but a gambled money saving strategy.

If Musk applies the same kind of strategy to other parts of the company, it begins to make a lot more sense.

 

[LightRoasted]

For your consideration ...

How about a simple thought experiment? Aka, critical thinking.

In the past, when the internal combustion engine became a thing, and the horse and buggy were replaced with automobiles, what did the federal government and the states do? Why they built roads and other infrastructure such a bridges and so forth of course, and began to tax the sale of petrol to pay for those needed improvements. However, they did not build, nor did they subsidize, the building of any gas filling stations. Nor did they subsidize these new fangled contraptions. Leaving that to the automobile manufacturers to make an affordable and competing product. Aka the marketplace.

So why the hell are the federal government, and state governments, subsidizing charging stations, (and EV's), or outright building out charging stations for these electric vehicles? If, these EV's are so the next great thing for all of humanity, why are not the actual producers, or distributors, of electricity, building these charging stations across America, just as the oil companies once did? Why doesn't, say, SMECO, build SMECO branded charging facilities in Southern Maryland? Build them out truck stop style with a restaurant, gaming room, etc., so while cars charge up, customers can do something for that hour or two, or three, that is enjoyable? BGE could build their own charging stations, as well as every other electric energy company and profit handsomely from them, just as the oil companies did. Instead of signs that list the price of a gallon of gas, those electric signs will display the price in kwh's, with the appropriate state sales tax per kwh added of course to continue paying for the roads they use. Instead, there is a hodgepodge of non-related non-electric companies setting up charging stations.

My God! Just think of it. With all the profits realized by those electric companies opening up their very own charging/rest stations, they wouldn't need to raise electric rates for homes and businesses, and, it may possibly even lower the price per kwh for the regular, non EV owner, households.

 

[PeoplesElbow]

I was leaning that way recently over the decision to lay off nearly the entire charging team. But then I saw an article that made a lot of sense. It has to do with the adoption of the NACS connector. Prior, Tesla was the only company that had rights to it. Once the rights were released and other car manufacturers got on board, the competing charge companies like Electrify America have all been switching to NACS. With all of these companies now providing charge points that are Tesla compatible, there is no longer an urgent need to expand the Tesla charge stations. Let the other companies pick up the load and save money on deployment of "unnecessary" redundant stations. In NYC, there were Tesla "abandoned" charge stations which have been bought out by competitors. Yes, Tesla charge stations were far superior, but once there is an outcry from people to fix/improve other stations, they will be forced to improve. Nothing but a gambled money saving strategy.

If Musk applies the same kind of strategy to other parts of the company, it begins to make a lot more sense.

Well it didn't take long to change his mind.

After Firing Entire Supercharger Team, Elon Musk Reverses Course and Says He'll Be Spending $500 Million on Growing the Charging Network

After firing the 500-person EV charging team, Tesla CEO Elon Musk has reversed course, saying he's still committed to expanding the network.

futurism.com

 

[PeoplesElbow]

For your consideration ...

How about a simple thought experiment? Aka, critical thinking.

In the past, when the internal combustion engine became a thing, and the horse and buggy were replaced with automobiles, what did the federal government and the states do? Why they built roads and other infrastructure such a bridges and so forth of course, and began to tax the sale of petrol to pay for those needed improvements. However, they did not build, nor did they subsidize, the building of any gas filling stations. Nor did they subsidize these new fangled contraptions. Leaving that to the automobile manufacturers to make an affordable and competing product. Aka the marketplace.

So why the hell are the federal government, and state governments, subsidizing charging stations, (and EV's), or outright building out charging stations for these electric vehicles? If, these EV's are so the next great thing for all of humanity, why are not the actual producers, or distributors, of electricity, building these charging stations across America, just as the oil companies once did? Why doesn't, say, SMECO, build SMECO branded charging facilities in Southern Maryland? Build them out truck stop style with a restaurant, gaming room, etc., so while cars charge up, customers can do something for that hour or two, or three, that is enjoyable? BGE could build their own charging stations, as well as every other electric energy company and profit handsomely from them, just as the oil companies did. Instead of signs that list the price of a gallon of gas, those electric signs will display the price in kwh's, with the appropriate state sales tax per kwh added of course to continue paying for the roads they use. Instead, there is a hodgepodge of non-related non-electric companies setting up charging stations.

My God! Just think of it. With all the profits realized by those electric companies opening up their very own charging/rest stations, they wouldn't need to raise electric rates for homes and businesses, and, it may possibly even lower the price per kwh for the regular, non EV owner, households.

Forces within the government weren't trying to replace horses then, at least I don't think so. Then again maybe the Eisenhower interstate system may have been a thank you to the auto industry for retooling to build planes and tanks for WW2.

 

[HemiHauler]

Biden White House to expand tariffs on Chinese trade

President likely to add sectors such as electric vehicles, batteries and solar cells to range of levies set up under Donald Trump

www.theguardian.com

100% tariffs on Chinese EV imports.

Remember, China are the bad actors for protecting their economic interests and the US doing the same thing (with a much stronger hand) is somehow laudable.

When the world’s most powerful nation perceives that her citizens may prefer imported products rather than ones manufactured domestically and uses protective tariffs because, quite frankly, we can’t compete in this market, it’s not a good look.

Yet another reason Biden and Trump are no different in this respect.

 

[phreddyp]

L

Biden White House to expand tariffs on Chinese trade

President likely to add sectors such as electric vehicles, batteries and solar cells to range of levies set up under Donald Trump

www.theguardian.com

100% tariffs on Chinese EV imports.

Remember, China are the bad actors for protecting their economic interests and the US doing the same thing (with a much stronger hand) is somehow laudable.

When the world’s most powerful nation perceives that her citizens may prefer imported products rather than ones manufactured domestically and uses protective tariffs because, quite frankly, we can’t compete in this market, it’s not a good look.

Yet another reason Biden and Trump are no different in this respect.

Lol

 

[glhs837]

Well it didn't take long to change his mind.

After Firing Entire Supercharger Team, Elon Musk Reverses Course and Says He'll Be Spending $500 Million on Growing the Charging Network

After firing the 500-person EV charging team, Tesla CEO Elon Musk has reversed course, saying he's still committed to expanding the network.

futurism.com

So, given he never made any statement before the firings, we cant see if this is a reversal or a statement of facts that were not known?

We knew about the firings and layoffs. People assumed this meant a stoppage of the SC buildout.

Also the lack of a dealer network means they are all corporate Tesla, that in itself should guarantee the exact same experience for everyone no matter where they are, same training same message etc. It should be a strength in cases like these, but it seems they are less consistent than a bunch of independently owned dealers.

Maybe it's me, but Musk seems to be a flake in the direction of the company.

Yep, and it does need to get better. Inconsistency might be the same percentage as it is with ICE dealers but as you note, its going to be more apparent with Teslas fewer dealers. Plenty of people have crappy experiences with traditional dealers, but Jalopnik isnt going to make those stories national, unless its an egregious issue.

Honestly cant tell if Musk is making changes for the long term good or just flailing. Had the company never faced critical points before, I might lean towards the latter. But there have been two or three times the future looked pretty uncertain and he pulled it through. So I'll call it 50/50.

You are wasting your breath, that moron will NEVER understand and if he did would never admit it.

So disagreeing with you makes one a moron.

 

[phreddyp]

So, given he never made any statement before the firings, we cant see if this is a reversal or a statement of facts that were not known?

We knew about the firings and layoffs. People assumed this meant a stoppage of the SC buildout.


Yep, and it does need to get better. Inconsistency might be the same percentage as it is with ICE dealers but as you note, its going to be more apparent with Teslas fewer dealers. Plenty of people have crappy experiences with traditional dealers, but Jalopnik isnt going to make those stories national, unless its an egregious issue.

Honestly cant tell if Musk is making changes for the long term good or just flailing. Had the company never faced critical points before, I might lean towards the latter. But there have been two or three times the future looked pretty uncertain and he pulled it through. So I'll call it 50/50.



So disagreeing with you makes one a moron.

The Elon Ponzi scheme is alive and well.

YES! All EV enthusiasts are, YOU are NOT alone.

 

[GURPS]

100% tariffs on Chinese EV imports.

UAW Pay Off

 

[glhs837]

The Elon Ponzi scheme is alive and well.

YES! All EV enthusiasts are YOU are NOT alone.

It's a pity the forum doesn't have a "remind me" feature like reddit.

 

[phreddyp]

It's a pity the forum doesn't have a "remind me" feature like reddit.

Just make friends with HH, he/she remembers everything not relevant. You may be their soulmate.

 

[HemiHauler]

UAW Pay Off

Duh. That’s the entire function of protectionist policies like this.

 

[PeoplesElbow]

So, given he never made any statement before the firings, we cant see if this is a reversal or a statement of facts that were not known?

We knew about the firings and layoffs. People assumed this meant a stoppage of the SC buildout.


Yep, and it does need to get better. Inconsistency might be the same percentage as it is with ICE dealers but as you note, its going to be more apparent with Teslas fewer dealers. Plenty of people have crappy experiences with traditional dealers, but Jalopnik isnt going to make those stories national, unless its an egregious issue.

Honestly cant tell if Musk is making changes for the long term good or just flailing. Had the company never faced critical points before, I might lean towards the latter. But there have been two or three times the future looked pretty uncertain and he pulled it through. So I'll call it 50/50.



So disagreeing with you makes one a moron.

There were SC stations that were halted weren't there? I seem to remember quite a few got the axe in Texas and New York.

With an ICE dealer, if Toyota of Southern Maryland pissed me off I could go to Prince Frederick or Waldorf easily, can't do that with Tesla. I gave a coworker the same advise for Mercedes, she drives to Alexandra for an oil change..... gets back to LP and finds out they forgot something, but had to have that status symbol. Part of this is our geography, but with Tesla that is the same thing in most of the country because there are so few centers.

 

[PeoplesElbow]

More weirdness from Germany gigafactory, how much more will it take for Tesla to abandon Germany.

Protesters Break Fence, Swarm Tesla Gigafactory

Masked protesters broke down a fence and tried to breach a Tesla factory building in Germany in order to stop expansion plans.

futurism.com

 

[glhs837]

There were SC stations that were halted weren't there? I seem to remember quite a few got the axe in Texas and New York.

With an ICE dealer, if Toyota of Southern Maryland pissed me off I could go to Prince Frederick or Waldorf easily, can't do that with Tesla. I gave a coworker the same advise for Mercedes, she drives to Alexandra for an oil change..... gets back to LP and finds out they forgot something, but had to have that status symbol. Part of this is our geography, but with Tesla that is the same thing in most of the country because there are so few centers.

So, on charging. What Ive heard that makes sense is that they are going to focus more on adding more chargers to existing stations to leave room for other companies to deploy NACS stations. One of the biggests costs in network expansion is site aquisition and preparation. Remove most of that and you can deploy a helluva lot more plugs.

 

[PeoplesElbow]

So, on charging. What Ive heard that makes sense is that they are going to focus more on adding more chargers to existing stations to leave room for other companies to deploy NACS stations. One of the biggests costs in network expansion is site aquisition and preparation. Remove most of that and you can deploy a helluva lot more plugs.

Currently that only matters if the chargers are full, I think most people's trepidation involves there not being a big enough network. Guessing that problem is mostly a big city thing because the more rural stations I've seen always have an open charger.

 

[glhs837]

Currently that only matters if the chargers are full, I think most people's trepidation involves there not being a big enough network. Guessing that problem is mostly a big city thing because the more rural stations I've seen always have an open charger.

So, when the net gains negative attention is always when stations are overwhelmed, right? Or more rarely when a station is damaged. Also, we have seen the first non Tesla deploment of Superchargers, correct? Expect to see more of that. TEsla makes money on selling the unit, and I assume a cut off the top. With no downside of site aquisition and prep.

 

[PeoplesElbow]

So, when the net gains negative attention is always when stations are overwhelmed, right? Or more rarely when a station is damaged. Also, we have seen the first non Tesla deploment of Superchargers, correct? Expect to see more of that. TEsla makes money on selling the unit, and I assume a cut off the top. With no downside of site aquisition and prep.

That's a good plan, if their business was chargers. Their business is cars and having a wide network of chargers is their selling point. Trusting it to "contractors" is a gamble. If I remember correctly were t you big on Tesla as a company because it was a fully integrated top to bottom operation?

 

[glhs837]

That's a good plan, if their business was chargers. Their business is cars and having a wide network of chargers is their selling point. Trusting it to "contractors" is a gamble. If I remember correctly were t you big on Tesla as a company because it was a fully integrated top to bottom operation?

So, the charging network is a business even though it didn't start that way. Should they have kept buying plots and installing the stuff to connect? Must be a reason they are not. Is it a good reason? Can't say, don't have the data. So about the risk. The Superchargers others are installing are not TEsla branded, so maybe that's a mitigation against?

And yep, integration is a huge money saver. Reduce the number of middlemen for your parts, reduce the integration cost and timeline. How does the Tesla specific SC network look in a year or two? No idea.

 

[PeoplesElbow]

How does the Tesla specific SC network look in a year or two? No idea.

Tesla can't say either now, they have given up control of their biggest selling point. Unless there was some other deal that caused them to do this it is too big of a risk IMHO. Maybe no monopoly lawsuit if they do this?